I have been involved in a day long discussion with an old friend I got reacquainted with on the Internet. We will call him C. I guess he is involved in ministry and posts questions on his page everyday. His question for today is below followed by my response. His response to me took place on email. Don't let anyone put you under the law! P.S. I have no idea why he calls me "Champion." Enjoy...
C: THE QUESTION IS: WHAT DOES THE "TEN COMMANDMENTS SHOW US?"
ME: The entire law, not just the 10 Commandments, show us our sinfulness so we will turn to Christ by faith. The Law is for unbelievers not for Christians. "So the law was put in charge to lead us to Christ that we might be justified by faith. Now that faith has come, we are no longer under the supervision of the law (Galatians 3:24-25)." "We also know that law is made not for the righteous but for lawbreakers and rebels, the ungodly and sinful, the unholy and irreligious; for those who kill their fathers or mothers, for murderers, for adulterers and perverts, for slave traders and liars and perjurers-and for whatever else is contrary to the sound doctrine that conforms to the glorious gospel of the blessed God, which he entrusted to me (1 Timothy 1:9-11)." Christians are led from within by the Holy Spirit. We are not led by laws designed to modify our behavior.
C: Champion,great great word and thanks for your answer. Everything you said is correct, but what does it "show" us, and do Christians still need to obey the ten commandment. for example in the ten commandments (Old testament) is says don't commit adultery, but in the new testament it says if a man "lust" after a woman he commits adultery in his heart.
ME: Hey C, no Christians do not need to obey the 10 Commandments. Christ amplified the law in order to bury us so that we would realize that we cannot live up to God's standard of perfection. God doesn't require our best efforts, He demands perfection. A perfection we are unable to live up to. The law was God's contribution to man's best effort to be like Him. And we fail miserably. That is why Jesus did for us what we could not do; fulfill the law by walking in perfect obedience and dying in our place so that, in Him, we could approach God. The New Covenant did not start until after Jesus died, it was not in effect during His life. That is why He preached the law. He was preparing us for the cross. According to Titus, it is the grace of God that teaches us to say no to ungodliness, not the law of God. We live by faith in Christ and what He has done for us and desires to do through us. If Christians were to live by the law then there was no need for Christ to have come.
C: Champion everything you said is correct, but if we had nothing to obey, then would there be any disobedience?. The ten commands is a "mirror" of who we used to be and our need for a savior. It shows us our flaws. 2 Corinthians 5:17 says, therefore any man who is in Christ Jesus he is a new creation, old things have passed away and all things our new. Let me ask you this, if we don't have to obey the ten commandment, then why is stealing wrong, [adultery] wrong, taking God's name in vain wrong, disrespecting our parents wrong. Yes we are not "under" the law but we still as christian must "obey" the Ten commandment. Champion your input is awesome. Thanks for being apart of these questions. It is to help us grow "together" as believers in Christ.
ME: Hey C, if we are under the law then we are subject to the penalties for disobeying the law, which is death in just about every situation. Romans 1:17 and Galatians 3:11 say that the "righteous will live by faith." We don't live by law. As I stated earlier, Titus 2:12 says it is the grace of God that "teaches us to say "No" to ungodliness and worldly passions, and to live self-controlled, upright and godly lives in this present age." Let me ask this, if we are being controlled by the Holy Spirit from within is He going to lead us into sin? Sin is still sin regardless of the Covenants, but the Christian life is not about learning to stop sinning, it is about learning to trust God in the midst of our sins. James 2:10 says that "For whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles at just one point is guilty of breaking all of it." If we are subject to the law we have to obey all 613 commandments not just the first 10. How are you doing in that area? Besides, am I subject to keeping the Sabbath as well? That is one of the 10. How are you doing at not coveting? That is one of the 10 as well. And if we are to keep the law, we have to institute the penalties and sacrifices required by the law when we sin. And Hebrews 10:18 says, "there is no longer any sacrifice for sin." If someone steals, commits adultery or violates the Sabbath are we to take them to the city limits and stone them to death? That is what the law requires. If you want to live under the law that is your choice. However, I don't want to fall from grace (Galatians 5:4) by trying to live under laws designed to lead me to Christ. Thanks.
C: All that is right. We are not under the law, but we still need to obey what it says. Thanks bro.
ME: Thanks for discussion, man.. Although, I have to say that if you believed all I wrote was right, you would not conclude we can obey the law. Nobody can.
C: You are right, but we still have to obey His word bro. we are "not"under the law, but we still need to obey it. Champion do study on it bro. If that was the case we could live anyway want. Champion I want you to read Mathew 5:26-30.
ME: Thanks C, I am familiar with that passage and the Sermon on the Mount. I am not new to the subject. We just disagree on what Jesus was trying to do. He was trying to bury his audience who thought they had a righteousness of their own through their obedience. Jesus was preparing them (and us) for the cross by trying to show us we could not live up to God's standards (Matthew 5:48). If Christians are under law than we have to throw away the Pauline epistles and the book of Hebrews. I put up enough scripture I believe clearly states we are not under law. We will just have to agree to disagree. In Him.
C: Bro, I am not saying we are under the "law", we are NOT UNDER THE LAW, but we still have to obey it. Plain and simple bro. Champion have a great day. Champion JOHN 14:15 says, if you LOVE [ME] YOU WILL"OBEY" ME. 1 SAMUEL 15:22, God says, He wants are "obedience" more than sacrifice.The standard we should be living by is all of His word not some of His word. Luke 6:46 says why do you call me lord lord and don't "obey". We can't obey on our own, you are right but the Holy [Spirit] empowers and convicts us to obey bro. I really appreciate the input bro.
ME: Under it and obeying it are the same thing. The Holy Spirit did not come to help us obey the law. The Holy Spirit is our life who guides us from within. As for John 14:15, you have to conclude that you don't love God because you can't obey His commands. We love because He first loved us (1 John). C, you have to obey the entire law and if you don't you are subject to the penalties for disobedience. God doesn't demand our best efforts, he demands perfection. I know you haven't obeyed the law perfectly. If law keeping was what we were to do, why did Paul consider his legalistic righteousness as loss? You have yet to address the passages from Romans and Galatians. We can go round and round on this. As I said before, if you want to try and obey the law, obey all of it, not just those things easiest to obey like not committing adultery. I refuse to allow myself to be burdened by a yoke of slavery not even the Jews could obey. I live by faith, not by law. I am righteous in God's site because of my faith in Christ, not because of my obedience to the Law. In Him
....AND THE BATTLE CONTINUES
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